Whisky. With faith in staves.

An interview with St. Kilian Distillers founder and CEO Andreas Thümmler

By Jörg Adrian, Managing Director adrian küchen www.adrian-kuechen.de

May we introduce: Andreas Thümmler. Investment banker. Whisky lover. Connoisseur. Visionary. A few years ago, the idea of producing his own whisky in his birthplace germinated in him. His path took him from London to other adopted homes such as Los Angeles and San Francisco. Today, we meet him here. In small Rüdenau.

Scholars disagree: Ireland or Scotland? Whisky lovers, however, agree: They don't care! Because wherever whisky may have originated: We are in Rüdenau! And a completely different story is being written here.

Welcome to the home of Germany's largest distillery and one of the most modern in the world. St. Kilian Distillers. Since its remarkable conversion, the former clothing factory now produces a completely different kind of 'stuff'. And it is so excellent that there is almost no room left for another certificate on the meter-high Wall of Fame in the entrance area.

The town, with just 750 souls, has long since mutated into a mecca for 40,000 throats. That's how many visitors the distillery has had so far. Well distributed, of course. Because we don't notice any of the hustle and bustle – and the whisky can mature in peace. With this pilgrimage site for whisky enthusiasts, Andi Thümmler has brought an impressive surge of popularity to the idyllic community in Lower Franconia. Distilled, to be precise.

While Andi gives us insights into the hallowed halls of the saintly patron, we are not only allowed to curiously sniff the Distillers' air. We also reverently stick our noses into glasses that are handed to us. Filled with top-class and high-proof peated drops that even the boss doesn't know yet. A blend that is currently being tasted by experts. Pipetted directly from a barrel. When you consider that this is the daily work of the distillers! It could be worse – we admit with relish. And we don't just mean the whisky. And we get another one to taste right away.

a.: Andi – A small, big question first: the little e, Whisky or Whiskey?

Andi: In Ireland and America, it's spelled with an e. The Scots omit it. And that also tells you which type of whisky we are closest to.

So you're Scotland fans?

Above all: whisky lovers! But we are very Scottish in how we produce our whisky. Regardless of our facility. Our pot still, the copper still, is manufactured in one of Scotland's most renowned coppersmiths – in the most traditional way. And according to our ideas. Anyone standing before this colossal still feels awe. And knows why we burn for Scotland. Or rather: like in Scotland. (laughs)

So, is this traditional copper still your "secret weapon" against boring standard brews?

Haha, no, we have Super Mario.

Super Mario?

Of course (laughs loudly) Mario Rudolf. He is an absolute exceptional whisky talent. First, he was a master brewer at renowned breweries; then he came to us. David Hayes, who immediately recognized his talent, told him that he should first complete an international trainee program and arranged various placements for him. So Mario went "on the tramp," from distillery to distillery, and was allowed to learn from the best of the best. After years, he returned with immense knowledge and notes. Today, he is our Master Distiller – at not even 40 years old, he has received more gold medals for his whiskies than David in 40 years. We call him Super Mario. David has also referred to him as "Cask Wizard."

Respect! Just for clarification... David Hayes?

Oh, sorry. I rarely have to introduce him, as everyone in the scene simply knows him. David Hayes, the whisky doyen! The whisky pope! And our guiding spirit. He is Scottish but has also lived here in Rüdenau for four years to help conceptualize and build St. Kilian. We owe an incredible amount to his amazing experience. And not least to his connections.

You mean because of "Super Mario"?

Yes. But also regarding the ingredients. One example: Glenesk. That used to be a whisky distillery and is now a maltings – Glenesk Maltings. I absolutely wanted to source their peated malt. It's simply the best and thus contributes significantly to our high quality. The guy from Glenesk, however, initially had no interest whatsoever in exporting his peated malt abroad. The Scots are extremely peculiar about that! Only after David persuaded the producer did we get into business. For 6 years now, Eddie has been driving to us – Eddie is a truck driver from Glenesk who brings the malt to Rüdenau. Exclusively. Because we are the only customers in Continental Europe! And thus the absolute exception. We are incredibly proud of that.

So, this peated malt, does that create the smoky taste?

Yes, well, that's one of the basic ingredients. Grain is allowed to germinate briefly. And then it's dried again. This happens, among other things, over peat, which is traditionally used as fuel in Scotland. And that then gives the malt its unmistakable note.

... so peated whisky?

Peated whisky. Correct!

What else is needed for whisky besides malt?

In terms of ingredients? Barley malt, yeast, and water. We basically brew beer without hops. And that is then distilled.

Oh dear, "God preserve it." But only malt?

(Laughs) For the whisky, yes. In the first step, we brew the so-called Distillers Beer. This is created here in the wooden washbacks and has approx. 8% vol. Whisky and beer have a lot in common and also go well together. It's no coincidence that many brewers work for us, in addition to distillers.

And then this mash goes into the pot still for distillation?

There's a lot of love and detailed work in between – but by and large: yes. The spirit then has to mature for at least 3 years. From 3 years and the first day, it can then call itself whisky. Or rather: we can.

What makes a good whisky for you?

As banal as it sounds: taste. And you have to find that for yourself. So there isn't THE good whisky that everyone likes. That's very individual. Okay, of course, it also has to come from us. Because otherwise, it can't even taste good. Obvious!

Of course! ;) Is it true, the older, the better?

We're still talking about whisky, right? (laughs) You can't say: the older, the better – but the longer it's in the cask, the milder it is. Each cask is tasted repeatedly. And then, depending on its potential, a decision is made as to when the next sample will be taken. This is how we individually decide when the spirit is "ripe" to be a true St. Kilian. That means it can easily be 12, 16 or 21 years old...

How much does the cask actually contribute to the maturation or, rather, to the development of the "special note"?

The cask, of course, adds a very special flavor. This depends on the wood – but also on several other aspects. Perhaps I can explain it using the example of Bourbon Whiskey. In addition to barley, it also contains corn. Its starch sugar creates a vanilla-toffee aroma typical of Bourbon. Consequently, if we store our whisky in former Bourbon casks, we use this for flavor development. Over the years, the saturated staves gradually release this note back into the alcohol. And our whisky, in turn, acquires its very special coloring for the palate. By the way – as a side note – we have over 370 types of casks. More than any other distillery! This alone shows how multi-faceted our whiskies are.

Crazy! Speaking of barrels. Your storage is also really insane. We were there, but please tell us...

You mean the bunkers? Yes, that's impressive for us every single time. Because indeed: the biggest hurdle was, "where on earth are we going to store all these barrels?" Here we were really more than lucky that the former NATO bunkers in the immediate vicinity offered themselves – "Bunker City". This is a sprawling complex, hidden, in the middle of the forest; with 120 of these former ammunition depots. We own 15 – soon even 19 – of these buildings. There we store 500 – 600 barrels per bunker. The best thing about it is: due to the thick walls, there are hardly any temperature fluctuations. In addition: up there in the forest, the climate is very similar to that of the Scottish Highlands. Everything whisky loves – our Kilian Highlands in the Odenwald.

Please help us with the math. How many barrels do you store? But above all, where is the journey headed?

Currently? Here we have approx. 10,000 barrels in storage; 2,500 are added annually. The goal is to reach the 50,000-barrel mark in the medium term. Considering that we started with 700 per year...

But you don't just have large barrels now...

True. That's also one of our USPs. Anyone who wants can buy their own barrel from us. Developed according to personal taste. Exactly the brand you like. These whiskies are stored in these small private barrels that you see here on the shelves.

So that would be "my own" whisky?

Yes, exactly. We currently have approx. 1,000 barrel owners who indulge in this. These are our absolute hardcore fans, brand ambassadors!

And why a small barrel?

Whisky oxidizes faster in small barrels. This has to do with the volume-to-surface ratio. In these 30-liter barrels, the whisky is as developed after 3 years as it would normally be after 10 years. These small barrels are also not standard containers, but are specially made by a cooper. He saws a large barrel in half and makes short staves from the long ones. And so, one large barrel becomes one or two small ones.

Brilliant idea! Apropos: What's with the "earth maturation"?

A typical St. Kilian evening. (grins) We were sitting together. Sometime between glass one and ten, the thought arose, "What if our casks no longer 'classically' breathe?" What would happen? Flavor-wise. And generally. Well, we wouldn't be us... (and the grin visibly widens) Without further ado, the next morning we buried them in my garden. A meter-deep hole. A few casks in. Earth on top. Hole closed. Years later, we "raised" them. In a double sense, that is. It could have been that the whole cask had rotted. But on the contrary. Everything was fine. And it tasted good too: really good! Although really different. With that, we were truly pioneers. Even to the extent that representatives of the University of Oxford, who got wind of it, contacted us. And they actually stood on our doorstep later to conduct research on it. We didn't get a doctorate, but it was worth the fun! And the result even more so!

The new "house style"?

Anything goes, nothing's mandatory. For example, we have a special edition with the cult band Grave Digger. Heavy metal deserves good whisky! Plus: The guys are big fans of ours and true peatheads. Especially with the band name: Of course, we also buried some barrels! It would be a sin not to connect that thematically. The barrels even got gravestones. No, not irreverent – just a marketing gag: The band will live up to its name and dig up the whisky themselves. That's going to be a big deal. Regardless of the fact that I'm a rocker at heart myself! I'm super happy. And there's still a lot more to come... Rock 'n' Roll!

Another "headliner"?

Okay, because it's you: JUDAS PRIEST! For the band's 50th anniversary, there's a joint, liquid collaboration: an exclusive limited edition with these legends! Awesome, right?!

Definitely! Now that we're talking about big names: How did you get involved with Terence Hill and Bud Spencer?

Quite simply: They came to us.

What do you mean? Terence rode to Rüdenau on his horse?

Exactly! (laughs) Everyone knows the movies. They're brilliant! Absolute cult! And everyone knows that not only punches are thrown, but whiskey is also served. Maybe it was only a matter of time before Bavaria Film Studios asked us if we were interested in the rights. What a question?! Of course! Now there are already some brands. Bud Spencer matures in Italian Amarone casks, Terence Hill in Caribbean rum casks. And Terence Hill's hazelnut liqueur even contains hazelnuts from his homeland. All of them are not complicated or only for absolute whisky professionals. Rather, they are just right for entering the world of whisky. They are simply fun. And we make that possible for a broader clientele. After all, no one should be prevented from acquiring a taste!

We can see that you bear your name for a reason. True missionaries. Just like St. Kilian.